Students who come late to or miss the first class.
Students who come late to or miss the first class.
Comments?
I stress to my students the importance of being on time.
To be early is to be on time, to be on time is late and to be late is unacceptable.
Sheri
Hello George,
If students come late or miss the first class, I think I will accept it for the first time.
On the second class meeting, I will make sure to go over my syllabus clearly about attendant, and all the policy, requirement of the course.
Hi John-Howard,
I agree with you about the behavior of the beginning students verses the more senior students. They can be challenging when it comes to getting them there and for them to assume responsibility for their actions. We need to work with them on developing these skills and behaviors because they will be needed in their careers as you and I both know. It is a matter of them internalizing the fact that they will need them. In many cases it is maturity that is needed to get them to the point where they see attendance, interaction with peers, plus career expertise as being critical for success.
Gary
There is a whole bundle of issues here.
The first depends on whether the student missed the first class on his own hook, or because he was assigned late/did not clear Financial Aid/did not have Proof of Graduation. In the latter case, the student is as much a victim as anything, and I find it hard to penalize for this.
But penalizing for attendance, or rather, for tardiness, is a different issue -- in that absolutely I do not do it. Instead, I have 10% of the class mark reserved for Class Attitude -- explaining at the beginning of the class that I expect students to treat their classes responsibly, thereby showing a good attitude.
A good attitude means not talking when the instructor is lecturing, not surfing the Web when you should be working, and yes, arriving late or leaving early. I agree with the concept of "cultivating good work habits" -- and I do wonder if the 30% or so of students in my introductory classes who are habitually late behave the same way on the job!
Interestingly enough, when you get to the 300- and 400-level classes, these sorts of issues pretty much vanish. It is the initial acculturation which is hard, and which I think we do have an obligation to provide to the student.
Hi Avril,
Your comments made me smile. I hear that all the time from my students as well. When they ask that I want to answer "of course we don't do anything important, and no you didn't miss anything, I just conduct class so I can keep my job". But, I don't I do what you do, create value for their attendance. I have professional points that the students earn for their attendance. The students need to understand that there are consequences for everything in life, some consequences are good and others bad. That is life and students need to realize how life operates.
Gary
It is very frustrating for me when students ask "Is it okay to leave early?" or when they come up to me and say "I wasn't here last week, did I miss anything?" or worse yet, "I won't be here next class. Will I really be missing anything important?" What do they really expect us to say to that? At any rate, I don't like being a babysitter. I assign point values to attendance and tardiness. Therefore, anyone who doesn't comply must suffer the consequences. Although sometimes that's easier said than done.
I agree with Bob Anderson that punitive measures addressing tardiness (or absence) are not productive. I make every effort to keep my students mindful of the value of being in class and on-time, but that goal is not always possible for everybody to achieve.
People always hear the bottom line. Give them the statistics for it effects their future pay, benefits and fringe benefits. Every missed class has unintended consequences and they should be creatively pointed out to the class... particularly on days when the whole class is present. These statistics can be easily found with a simple Google search. Drive the point home: attendance is essential to future success.
My classes consist of students with jobs, single moms, struggling lives, and more. I never judge the reason for lateness or missing. If it is chronic I will talk to the student and see what we can work out, the best way to slip in quietly, how to let me know, and try to release them from the guilt and shame of being late or missing. If they have no real reasons I will let them know they are responsible for their actions and I can't let them make up what they miss being late and they can't come in during a student presentation. I encourage them to look at the long range habits being developed. I am not a dictator and after MANY years of teaching have found arbitrary tardy and attendance policies punitive and disruptive. I follow school requirements. I call missing students to see what I can do to help and I work hard to help them overcome obstacles. Education is the answer not punishment for situations that are just part of their life.
Hi Jo Anne,
I agree with your approach, and the idea of preparing students for their jobs.
There is a possiblity that our common personal experiences with medicine and dentistry prepares students to see schedules as "optional". Patients are often kept waiting, and many of our students' employers will run chronically late. Staying on time might become one of their major challenges in their career and we can help them develop habits that will help them combat that if we do as you say: set the standard for coming early and having a margin of safety. This approach is such a stress reducer!
Nancy Andrews
Hi Jo Anne,
I totally agree about treating the training as if it were the job. Getting used to being on time and there every day is a must if there is going to be career success later. Also, by being on time the students get the benefit of the entire class session so their technical skills will be developed at a higher level as well.
Gary
I will be tolerant but firm on my first day of class. I will understand that there may be confusion on where to show, time of class, etc (even though most printouts are very specific, there's still that overwhelmed mind that just gets things confused). But on that first day, I will establish my policy on attendance and tardiness. Since I am teaching a vocational skill that is very dependent on arriving BEFORE the start time to prepare for patients; in the same way, I will stress that importance with class. I want students to develop that habit of showing up early to avoid any mishaps that cannot be controlled (traffic) and to realize that in our occupation, you need time to prepare before seeing patients...in the same way, the student needs to be prepared before the start of class...be seated, have materials out, etc. I want them to treat the classroom as if they were going to their job. You don't show up late and you come prepared.
Hi Stacy,
I follow the same policy. The first class meeting I have a number of students that are late, trying to find parking or the room, etc. Just as you indicated with your students. After that it is be there and on time, period! There are exceptions but we work those out and I really never have any problems with attendance. The know that they are being trained to be professionals and they rise to the occasion.
Gary
I tolerate students being late or missing the first day, but I explain to them the importance of being on time and being present not only in the classroom but in their career field. I explain how the boss won't tolerate it, and ask what they think will be the consequence. They usually answer with "we would get fired." They get the point, and I usually don't have a problem after that. Oftentimes, they are incoming freshmen and have to get used to the parking situation at the beginning, and I help them get caught up, but I make it a point to stress sthe importance of not letting it happen again.
Hi Nancy,
Well said. This is how I start my classes as well. I try to really send the point home that they control their destiny. As you say why make it hard on yourself when you don't have to. Plus, if they want to keep their jobs in the future they are going to have to be on time and there every day.
Gary
I will tolerate lateness the first day as there are so many possible legitimate reasons but i explain politely and with a smile that i consider lateness rude and rudeness is not tolerated. Additionally lateness is addressed in the workplace by lack of promotion, being over looked for raises, and firing. The classroom equivalent to raise or lack of is grade penalty. i add that it hard enough to complete every assignment extremely well (A quality) so why ask for deductions for things you do have control over.
Hi Summer,
You make a number of excellent points about attendance and tardiness. This is something that bugs me a lot for the reasons you list. I have a strict policy on both that I enforce. Generally, I don't have a problem with either once they are clear about how I approach the class. The key is being understanding of what is going on in their lives. I work hard in this area as I know you do. Things do happen in the lives of our students and we need to understand the impact that these events have on their attendance. Communication is the key to working through these tough times and I appreciate your remarks about how you approach the management of student attendance.
Gary
Aaargh! There is some much that is communicated that first day that when students are absent it can throw them off the rest of the term/course. While I will usually spend a few minutes with the absent student reviewing the syllabus, etc., they can’t regain the discussion that took place, or the relevant, clarifying questions other students might have asked.
In general, I address absences and tardiness by repeatedly emphasizing the portion of their grade dedicated to those items. Also, by rewarding students that are on time, it can encourage those who are not. The beginning of class is a great time for a quick quiz review or pop quiz to reinforce on-time behavior.
Anybody ever gotten the "Is it okay to leave early?" question from a student? This always seems like such a weird question to me. Are you asking can you leave early and I won't care? Won't notice? Won't mark you down? Yes to all of the above. However, I am also not a jailer, holding you against your will.:-) I tell students that as responsible adults if they feel they must come late, miss class or leave early, there are definite consequences to that behavior. It is never "just okay" to miss class, but life also requires we make priorities and if no one else can pick up the kids from daycare…that’s life.
Additionally, there is a big difference to me between students who communicate the reasons for their tardiness or lateness, either in advance or at their earliest convenience, and those who don't. Working adults have busy lives, but if they communicate barriers, it is easier to help them overcome them.
Hi George,
I will accept students missing the first class or coming late. I won't after that. I have a clearly defined and strict attendance and tardy policy. I make the policy clear and enforce it. Based upon how points are given at the beginning of the class being tardy basically means you won't pass the course. Plus, when students are tardy they are saying "I am so important that I can come when I want and I am disrespecting all the rest of you that come on time." I won't let them do that to the rest of the class. We are training students to be professionals and part of that training is accountability so I make them accountable.
Gary
